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31i
SAINT VINCENT
GOVERNMENT
GAZETTE
4uhbinhld hid luthoritn>
Vol. 89.] SAINT VINCEN I'. TUESDAY, 9 OCTOBER. 1956. [No 53.
GOVERNMENT NOTICES.
No. 426.
LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL-BUDGET SESSION 1956.
It is notified for general information that the Budget Session of the
Legislative Council for the year 1956 will be held on Friday, 12th October, 1956,
at the Council Chamber, Kingstown, at 10 a.m.
The Order of the Day of this meeting is published with this issue of the
Gazette.
A cordial invitation to attend is extended to the General Public.
9th October, 1956.
(A. 1/1949.)
No. 294.
HURRICANE NOTICE.
It is hereby notified for general information that in the event of a hurri-
cane threatening or approaching the Island, the following warnings will be
given:-
CAUTIONARY
(1) A red flag with a black
rectangular centre will be
flown on Police Head-
quarters.
(2) Loud Speaker and Radio
AnnouncementS.
(3) Three saluting guns will
be fired.
(1) A red flag with a black
rectangular centre will be
flown from Police Sta-
tions.
(2) Loud Speaker and Radio
Announcements.
TAKE COVER
(1) Two red flags with black
rectangular centres one
above the other will be
flown on Police Head-
quarters.
(2) Church Bells will ring
for 5 minutes.
(3) Cotton Ginnery whistle
will blow for 5 minutes.
(4) The Siren will blow for 5
minutes.
(1) Two red flags with J elack
rectangular centres will
be flown from Police Sta-
tions.
(2) Church Bells will ring
for 5 minutes. *
KINGSTOWN
RURAL AREAS
17th July, 1956.
:W 25/1949).
x
~
,431i
316 SAINT VINCENT, TUESDAY, 9 OCTOBER. 196. -(No. 53).
No. 418.
IN THE MATTER OF THE LAND ACQUISITION ORDINANCE, 1946.
(No. 22 of 1946).
AND
IN THE MATTER OF THE ACQUISITION by the Governor-in-Council of a certain
parcel of land at Richmond Hill in the Parish of St. George for a public
purpose.
DECLARATION OF ACQUISITION OF LAND.
(SECOND PUBLICATION.)
WHEREAS it is enacted by Section 3 of the Land Acquisition Ordinance (No. 22
of 1946) that if the Governor-in-Council considers that any land should be
acquired for a public purpose he may cause a declaration to that effect to be
made:
AND WHEREAS it is considered by the Governor-in-Council that the under-
mentioned parcel of land should be acquired for a public purpose, to wit, the
provision of a right of way to Lot 17 of the Richmond Hill Reserve Allotments;
Now IT Is HEREBY DECLARED by His Excellency the Governor acting by and
with the advice and consent of the Executive Council of the Colony of St. Vincent
that upon the 2nd Publication of this Notice in the Gazette all that parcel of
land at Richmond Hill in the Parish of Saint George belonging to James Trent,
containing 339 sq. ft. and bounded on the 'North by Lot 17 belonging to Dorcas
Edwards, on the South by the Public Road, on the East by Lot 16 belonging to
gasies Trent and on the West by Lot 18 belonging to Belle Craigg, shall vest
absolutely in the Crown;
AND IT Is HEREBY FURTHER DECLARED AND NOTIFIED that a plan bearing
the number St. George 2 Folio 114 has been prepared by Mr. E. Stinson Campbell,
licensed Land Surveyor, and can be inspected at all reasonable hours at the
Survey Office in the town of Kingstown in the said Colony.
2nd October, 1956.
WP. 43/1947.)
No. 419.
ST. VINCENT CENTRAL ARROWROOT FACTORY.
ADVICE TO GROWERS-1956/57.
1. The Central Arrowroot Factory at Belle Vue will start buying roots from
Growers during November.
2. It is hoped that roots sold to the Factory will contain not less than 16%
extractable starch; this is a comparatively low standard as any arrowroot
dug at its proper stage of maturity yields at least 16% starch.
3. Roots will be weighed and bought at the Factory at the prices shown below.
Full payment for roots will be made every second Thursday for roots pur-
chased during the previous fortnight. A receipt must be obtained from the
Office showing the weight of roots and percentage of starch they contain.
4. Prices will be as follows:-
Roots yielding 18% and over $1.80 per 100 lb.
17% ,, ,, up to but not including 18% 1.70 ,,
16% . 17% 1.60 .
15% 16% 1.50 .
14% 15% 1.40 .. ..
13% . 14% 1.30 .
.. 12% 13% 1.20 .. ..
11% . 12% 1.10 .
10% . 11% 1.00 .
5. Not less than 1,000 pounds of roots will be accepted at the Factory from any
grower for any one delivery.
SAINT VINCENT, TUESDAY, 9 OCTOBER. 1956.-(No. 53). 317
6. The Factory reserves the right to make a reduction in the effective weight
of any roots that are old and decaying, or that have an excessive amount of
mud, earth, stones, sticks, or any foreign matter.
7. All Growers who intend to sell roots to the Central Factory and who have
given their names to the Manager, Mr. R. CONNELL, are asked to keep in
touch with him and he will arrange with them when roots are to be dug
and delivered. This is essential for the efficient running of the Factory;
there can be no guarantee that roots will be accepted from any Grower
who has not communicated with the Manager or who does not deliver at
the time arranged.
8. The Factory reserves the right in case of mechanical breakdown or other
unavoidable cause to give notice to stop deliveries where necessary. Every
effort will be made to give such notice in good time and to re-start at the
earliest opportunity, but the Factory cannot accept responsibility for loss
or damage in such cases.
9. The Central Factory is not a profit making concern. The loan from which
it was built has to be repaid; but after interest and principal have been fully
repaid and a proper amount allowed for the efficient running and mainten-
ance of the Factory, any excess funds will be distributed at some future date
to Growers in accordance with their deliveries. Such excesses are not likely
to arise until after the first three or four years of operation.
2nd October. 1956
No. 427. No. 431.
APPOINTMENTS. BARROUALLIE TOWN BOARD
With reference to Government Notice lMr. CONRAD FRANCIS has been elect-
No. 416 of 2nd October, 19.56. Mr. LOUIS ed a member of thu Barrouallie Town
COOLS-LARTIGUI, O.B.E., Chief Secre- Board with effect fi om 24th September,
tary, Windward Islands, has b 'en ap- 1956. Mr. FRANCIS is filling the seat
pointed Governor's Deputi during His of Mr. E. A. JOACHIM, which was de-
Excellency's absence from Grvnada. cleared vacant.
9th October, 1956. 9th October, 1956.
(A. 211950 III.) ----
No. 432.
No. 428.
His Excellency tlih Goveinor has been
pleased to approve the appoint nt of
Mr. G. C. MILLAR to the post of Head-
master, Grammar School with effect,
from 20th Atgunt, 1956.
9th October, 1956.
(P.F. 834).
No. 429.
His Honour the Administrator has
been pleased to approve the :;i)i'oint-
ment of th, undernmentioned p ion s as
Sanitary Inspectors on one (1) year's
probation with effect front 1st August,
1956:-
(a) Mr. D. PROVIDENCE,
(b) Mr. E. KING.
9th October, 1956.
(P. F.'S 784,785).
No. 430.
MARRIAGE OFFICER.
The Reverend FRANCIS WILLIAM
MASON LAMB, M.D., Ch.B., M.R.C.S.,
L.R.C.P., has been appointed as Marriage
Officer of the Colony with effect from
9th October, 1956.
9th October, 1956.
(J. 22/1951)
ACTING APPOINTMENT.
Consequent on tLc grant of three (3)
inonthb' vwicatoiil l(ave to Mr. B. A-
ARTHUR. Mrs. S. E. MIcKELL has been
appointed to act :S Records Officer,
(lovernmient Office. xx\itl effect from 6th
October, 1956.
9th October, 1956.
(P.F. 402).
No. 433.
RESIGNATION.
.MARRIAGIP OFFICER.
Witl re ference to Government Notice
No. 531 of 13th Dect mber, 1955, the
Revered D. E. RUSSELL has resigned
as a Marriag, Ofice(r ( i d Official Atl( sor
of the Colony wivh effect from 4th
October, 1956.
9th October, 1956.
(J. 22119c1).
No. 434.
BEQUIA DISTRICT COUNCIL
Mr. C. M. M!ITCHEI.L has resigned as
Ch:irian of the Bi quia District Conncil
with effect from 15i1 Septeniber, 1956,
SAINT VINCENT, TUESDAY, 9 OCTOBER, 1956.-(No. 53).
Consequent on Mr. MITCHELL',S resig-
nation, Mr. FLORIS SIMMONS has been
elected Chairman, Bequia District Couin-
cil, to s-rve the unexpired period of Mr.
MITCHELL'S term.
9th October, 1956.
No. 435.
DISMISSAL
Mr. MARCUS GRIFFITH, Prison Officer,
Prison Department, St. Vincent, hasbe-n
dismissed the Service with effect from
Lst October, 1956.
9th October, 1956.
(J. 1011953.)
No. 436.
VACATION LEAVE
Mr. B. A. ARTHUR, Junior Clerk,
Government Office has been granted
the iritish Caribbeatn Currency Fund at
30th June, j956, is published with this
issue of the G;azette.
9th October, 1956.
No. 441.
Copies of Minutes of the Meeting of
the Legislative Council held on the 5th
July, 1956 which may be se n at Gov-
ernment Office, the Kingsto-wn Lilnary,
anid at all Revenue Offices are published
with this issue of the Gazette.
9th October, 1956.
No. 442.
VACANT POST.
VACANT POST OF SENIOR MEDICAL
OFFICER, GENERAL HOSPITAL,
BARBADOS.
Applica ions are invited foi ihe abo-ve
three months'vacation leave with effect post.
from 1st October, 1956. 2. Qualifications: Applicantsshould
be registered Medical Piactit i:( is and
9th Octoibr, 1956. should have betw en two to four years
v(P. F. 494)1 hospital experience.
3. Duties: The duties are those or-
No. 437. dinarily perform m((I Icy a Sen ioi Medi(al
LEAVE OF ABSENCE. Officer in a large acute general hospital
Honourable E. HUHES, Mem- of 500 beds and include attending to
beHonourablf the Executie and Legislative medical and surgical out-patients, visit-
Councils, has been granted three weeks ing wards, pe ratio midwifery,
leave of absence from 5th October. 1956. casualty duty, childr(n'Go clinic and adly
other duties as the (Goret nor oran-, duly
9th October, 1956. authorised officers nma) from time to
(A. 31/1948). time direct.
4. Salary and Appointment: The
No. 438. post is full time and pensionable with a
RESUMPTION OF DUTY. fixed salary of $5,040 p-r annum. A
-- temporary C.O.L.A. of $156 per annum
With reference to Gazette Notice No. is also payable. The salary is at present
389 of 11th September, 1956. Mr. S. B. under review. No private practice is
Cox resumed duties with effect from allowed. In case of a pensionable
1st October, 1956. appointment sala iy is sui.j ct to deduc-
9th October, 1956. tin of 4%o under the Widows and
(P,F. 300) Orphans Pension Act unl(e.s the Officer
is already a contributor to an approved
No. 439. Widows and Orphans Piersion Scinme
Mr. GORDON F. WHEKES, Senior of another Colony. Appeintient may
Binder, Government Printing Office, also be on agreement for th r( c years in
who had been granted 3 months vaca the first instance. If the officer aippoint-
tion leave with effect from 1st July, ed on agreement termnis is a control utor
1956 resumed duties with effect from to an approved Superiannuation Schb me
1st October, 1956. the employer's share will be paIid I y the
Government.
9th October, 1956. 5. Passages: An officer' appointed on
(['.F. 518). pensionableterlisis eligible f< rthe cost
of passages for himself and fan.ily from
No. 440. the place of recruitment up to a limit of
SUPPLEMENT TO GAZETTE. $1,440. If appointed on agreement, he
is eligible for the cost of passages for
The Statement of Securities held by himself and his family on appointment
the Crown Agents for Oversea Govern- and on satisfactory completion of agree-
ments and Administrations on behalf of 'ment up to a limit of $1,440 each way.
SA.I'NT VINCENT, TUESDAY, 9 OCTOBER, 1956.-(No. 53) 319
This amount may be increased to .1,920
if the Governor requires the officer to
travel by air. A bachelor is only
eligible for a return pass!,ge to place of
recruitment for himself'.
6. Leave and Leave Passages: Leave
is granted in accordance with local regu-
lations. Leave passages for a pension-
able officer are payable every three and
a half years in accordance with the
Civil Establishment (Leave Passages)
Order, 1952.
7. Quarters: Furnished quarters are
provided for pensionable officers at a
rental of 5% of basic salary. In the case
of officat s appointed on agreement terms,
furnished quarters are provided free of
charge; but if no such quarters are
available an allowance in lieu at the rate
of 10% of b isic salary is payable.
8. Applications stating age, qualifica-
tions and experience should be sub-
mitted to the Chief Secretary. Govern-
ment Headquarters. Bay Street to reach
him not later than ,he 24th October, 1956.
9th October, 1956.
No. 443.
LEGISLATION.
The Right Honourable the Seacretray
of St ite for the C dlonies has notified that
Her Majesty the QEuEN will not be
advised to exercise her power of dis-
allowance in respect of the following
Ordinance of this Government :-
No. 14 of 1956:-An Ordinance to
sanction certain plymnents from
the Public Treasury in excess of
the sums granted by the Appro-
priation (1954) Ordinance, 1953
(No. 3 of 1954) for the year end-
ed 31st December, 1954.
(F. 2f1953).
No. 444.
The under-mentioned Bills are pub-
lished with this issue of the Gazette and
may be seen at the Government Office,
Kingstown Library. District Post Offices,
Police Stations, and at all Revenue
Offices:-
Bill fortn Ordinance furtherto amend
the Medical R eistration Ordinance.
(M. 3i8/1948).
Bill for an Orli;iance to create the
)tice of Finatncial Secretary and
tle Offic of Accountant General
and to provide for the allocation of
duties heretofore performed by the
Colonial Treasurer between the
Financial Secretary and Accountant
General and for purposes incidental
to, connected with or consequential
upon any of th- foregoing purposes.
(J. 14/1956).
Bill fr an Oiiin:t.-ee to amend the
Rent Restriction Ordinance, 1945.
(J. 23/1942).
By Commald,
0. E. LEIGERrWOOD.
Acting Medical Registrar
GOVERNMENT OFFICE.
9th October, 1956.
DEPARTMENTAL AND
OTHER NOTICES.
SUPREME COURT NOTICES.
NOTICE is hereby given that a Sitting
of the Supreme Court of the Windward
Islands and Leeward Islands will be
held at the Court House in Kingstown,
for the trial of CRIMINAL causes on
Wednesday the 7th day of November,
1956, commencing at 10.00 o'clock in
the forenoon.
All parties concerned, also such per-
sons as are bound over by recognizance
to prosecute or give evidence, or sum-
moned as Jurors or witnesses are com-
manded to give their personal atten-
dance.
4th October, 1956.
NOTICE is hereby given that a Sitting
of the Supreme Court of the Windward
Islands and Leeward Islands will be
held at the Court House in Kingstown,
for the trial of CIVIL causes in the
Summary and Original Jurisdictions of
the Court on WVednesday the 71h day of
November, 1956, commencing at 10.00
o'clock in the forenoon.
4th October, 1956.
NOTICE is hereby given that a Sitting
otf the Supreme Court of the Windward
Islaim.'s and Leeward Islands will be
held at the Court House in Kingstown,
for the hearing of APPEALS FROM
MAGISTPIATES on W11ednesday the 7th
day of November, 1956, commencing at
10.00 o'clock in the forenoon.
C. E. 1. RAWLE,
Registrar. Supreme Court.
1? REGISTRAR'S OFFICE.
KINGSTOWN,
4th October, 1956.
320 SAINT VINCENT, TUESDAY, 9 OCTOBER, 1956.-5-No. 53.)
TREASURY NOTICE.
LAND AND HOUSE TAX NOTICE.
Notice is hereby given that the undermentioned persons having become
defaulters under the "Land and House Tax Ordinance", their properties having
been levied upon will be offered for sale at 1 pan.m. on Saturday 27th October,
1956, at the Treasury, Kingstown, for the recovery of taxes due.
A. D. W. JOHNSON,
Accountant General.
Treasury Chambers,
Kingstown.
2nd October, 1956.
DISTRICT II.
Name of Owner or
Occupier
Ambris, Robert
Birch, Emanuel
Cato, Phillip
Charles, Isaline
DeCall, Leopold
Dick, Jonathan
Dick, Wilfred
Homer, Romie
John, Victor
Lynch, Reuben
Ollivierre, Frederick
Regisford, David
Rodriques, Jeshurian
Shortte, Fitz-Gerald
Stephenson, Matthew
Thomas, Loretta A.
Weekes, Juliana
Williams, Robert
Woodley, Augustus
Situation of
Property
Biabou
Grants
New Prospect
Adelphi
Adelphi
Maderia Valley
Grants
Biabou
Bridgetown
Adelphi
Bridgetown
Adelphi
Maderia Valley
Biabou
Biabou
Biabou
Grants
Adelphi
Adelphi
Description of
Property
1 Dwelling house
1 House spot
4 Acres 10 poles
35 poles
1 acre
1 Dwelling house
1 Dwelling house
1 Dwelling house
1 House (shop)
2 rds. 30 poles
1 Dwelling house
2 acres
2 rds. 24 poles
1 acre 2 poles
1 Dwelling house
1 House spot
1 House spot
1 acre
2 acres
LAND AND HOUSE TAX NOTICE.
Notice is hereby given that the undermentioned persoiis having become
defaulters under the Land and House Tax Ordinance, their proprtiEs having
been levied upon will be offer, d for sale at 1 o'clock p.m. on Saturday 20th
October, 1956 at the Treasury, Kingstown, for the recovery of taxes due.
18th September, 1956.
Name of Owner.
Browne, Jonathan His.
Browne, M. B.
Cottle, Winifred
Crosby, Albert
Cruicksbank, Alexander
Fraser, George L.
George, Gertrude
Georgo, Matthias
Grant, Elton
Grant, Elton
Mayers, Albertina
Myers, R)bert
Prescod, Clara
Slater, Agnes
Huggins, Thomas
Lewis, Ambrozine Hrs.
McKenzie, Thomas
Robertson, George
Samuel, Martin
Samuel, Remesis
Williams, Daniel
DISTRICT III.
Situation of
Property.
('amlen Park
Ross Castle
Questelles
Montrose
Camden Park
Montrose
Montrose
Low Imans
Buccam ent
Buccarnent
Ottley Hall
Montrose
Montrose
Vermont
DISTRICT V.
Belmont
Troumaca
Coull's Hill
Rose Hall
Trou maca
Rose Hall
Troumaca
A. D. W JOHNSON,
Accountant General,
Description of
Property.
1 spot
1 rd. 6 poles
1 house
1 spot
1 house
1 spot
1 spot
1 spot
1 jenny donkey
I house
1 spot
1 house
1 spot
1 house
1 house
1 spot
1 spot
1 house
1 house
1 house spot
1 spot
SAINT VINCENT. TUESDAY, 9 OCTOBER, 1956.-(No. 53&. 321
PUBLIC WORKS NOTICE.
FOR SALE
STATEMENT OF CURRENCY NOTES CIR.
CULATION IN THE BRITISH CARIBBEAN
TERRITORIES (EASTERN GROUP)
Four Ford Trucks, T. 61, 181, 217 and UN 1st SEPTEMBER, 1956.
225 and one Standard Pickup T. 510 Average Circulation during
owned by the Public Works Depart- July, 1956 :_
meant. Offers should be made in writing Br. Caribbean Cur-
to the Superintendent of Works nolt later rency Notes ...$57,987,533.00
than 15th October, 1956. Demonetjwd Govt.
The vehicles may be inspected at! es (ontttmling... 1,178753.00
Arnos Vale on any working day between ____0
the hours of 8,30 a.m. and 4.00 p.m. 59166,286.00
except on Saturdays. $ .
B ..irti h ^>.~l-- C ibb
27th Septe
EDUC
R. G. SMITH,
Superintendent of WIorks.
muber, 1956.
ATION NOTICES.
ENTRANCE EXAMINATIONS
An Examination for Entry to the
Grammar School in January, 1957, will
be held at the School on Saturday, 27th
October, 1956, at 9.00 a.m. All can-
didates must bring rulers, pens and pen-
cils. Each Candidate must forward to
the Headmaster not later than Weldnes-
day, 24th October, a birth certificate and
a written testimonial from his present
Head Teacher.
C. G. MILLER,
B.A., A.C.P., DIP., ED.
Headmaster,
Grammar School.
5th October, 1956.
The Examination for entrance in
January, 1957 to the Girls' High School
will be held in the School on Saturday
27Lh October.
Candidates should arrive at 8.30 a.m.
for registration, and bring with them
writing materials and a copy of their
birth certificate. Writing paper will
be provided.
J. M. BUCHAN,
Headmistress,
Girls' High Schcol.
5th October. 1956.
l I .. iean [i u -
rency Notes in circu-
lation on let Septemb
1956:-
Trinidad & Tolibago
Barbados ...
Bri:ish Guiana ...
Grenana ...
St. Vincent ...
St. Lucia ...
Dominici ...
Antigua ...
St. Kitts ...
Moniserrat
er,
$27,737,611.00
5,834,625.00
14,701,938.00
2.670,100.00
504,400.00
934,000.00
1,343,400.00
2,075,300.00
1,519,500.00
324,905.00
Total British Caribbean
Currency Notes ... $57,645,779.00
Demonetized Trini-
dad & Tobago Govt.
notes outs:and-
ing ...
Demonetized Brit-
ish Guiana Govt.
notes outstand-
ing
Demonetized Bar-
bados Govt. uote,
outstanding ...
S 795,439.00
288,110.00
74,764.00
Total demonetized Govt.
notes outstanding ... $1,158,313.00
Total circulation on 1st
September. 1956 ...
$58,804,092.00
L. SPENCE,
Executive Commissioner,
British Caribbean Currency
Board.
BRITISH CARIBBEAN CURRENCY
BOARD.
TREASURY CHAMBERS,
PORT-OF-SPAIN,
TRINIDAD, B.W.I.
P.frTED BY THE GOVERNMENT PRINTER, AT THE GOVERIEWET PRINMTG OFFICE,
xNmGSTOWn ST. V4xCES.
[ Price: 24 cents. ]
Publications Not Available
Saint Vincent government
gazette
v. 89 no.
53
Order of the Day
Supplement
HANSARD,
PROCEEDINGS AND DEBATES IN THE SECOND SESSION (1955-1956) OF
THE LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL, COLONY OF ST. VINCENT,
BRITISH WEST INDIES.
14th Sitting
Thursday, 5th July, 1956.
The Honourable Legislative Council met at 10 o'clock this morning.
PRAYERS F L
[MR. PRESIDENT in the Chair]
PRESENT:
A. D. W. JOHNSON, Acting Financial Secretary, l
E. A. C. HUGHES, First Nominated Member,
J. A. BAYNES, Member for St. George.
A. C. CYRUS, Second Nominated Member,
E. T. JOSHUA, Member for North Windward,
S. E. SLATER, Member for North Leeward,
C. L. TANNIS, Member for the Grenadines, (Minister for Com-
munications and Works),
L. C. LATHAM, Member for South Windward,
R. E. BAYNES, Member for Kingstown (Minister for Trade and
Production),
H. F. YOUNG, Member for South Leeward.
ABSENT:
B. F. DIAs, Crown Attorney, (Excused)
G. H. CHARLES, Member for Central Windward, (Minister for
Social Services).
OATH
The Oath of Clerk of the Legislative
Council was administered to the Acting
Clerk, Mr. F. G. Thomas.
MINUTES
The Minutes of the meetings of the
22nd May and 7th June, having been pre-
viously circulated, were taken as read
and were confirmed.
ANNOUNCEMENTS
Bills-Certificates of Urgency for
PRESIDENT: Honourable Members, I
have to announce that at the due time
I shall be putting in Certificates of
Ucgen y in respect of the two short
technical bills which are down for first
reading today so that the House may be
given an opportunity of giving them
Second and Third readings as well.
Honourable
>
,,
The Honourable
The Firearms Bill
I have also to announce that the House
will not be asked at this meeting today
to proceed with the Second reading of
the Firearms Bill for the reason that
the Honourable Crown Attorney is not
here today.
The Agricultural Small Tenancies
Bill
The Agricultural Small Tenancies Bill
which is in Committee, I have to an-
nounce has not yet been reported upon
by the Select Committee and will not be
dealt with at this Meeting to-day.
NOTICE OF MOTION
HON. J. A. BAYNES:
WHEREAS Federation hah been ac-
cepted and agreed to by a minority
group of inhabitants in this island to
the political destiny and advancement
of the majority; and
WHEREAS the said majority is without
a proper knowledge and definition of
Federation in a broad outline; and
WHEREAS it is the duty of this Gov-
ernment to enlighten the people as a
whole on the subject of Federation;
BE IT RESOLVED that the Public Rela-
tions Officer be relieved of. some of his
present duties so that he be appointed
to carry out an island-wide series of
lectures in Federation, and that he be
allowed the cooperation of the Elected
Members of the Legislative Council in
their constituencies and that of any
person or group who may be willing to
assist.
DOCUMENTS LAID
The following Papers were laid in the
Council Table: -
Council Paper No. 30 of 1956: The
Young's Island Rental and Control
Rules.
Council Paper No. 31 of 1956: The
Animals (Diseases and Importa-
tion) Control Regulation. .
Council Paper No. 32 of 1956: Report
on the St. Vincent Public Library for
the year 1955.
MOTIONS
Education System-Commission of En-
quiry into
HON. L. C. LATHAM: Mr. President,
Honourable Members,
WHEREAS the Education Report for
the Colony for the year 1954 which was
recently released shows that the stand-
ard of attainment of the majority of
Primary Schools in the Colony is un-
satisfactory.
AND WHEREAS there is obvious dis-
satisfaction among the rank and file
of the Primary School Teachers, hence
the very unsatisfactory result in the
schools as pointed out in the report
under review.
BE IT RESOLVED that a Commission be
appointed at the earliest possible date
and the necessary enquiry into the Edu-
cation system of the colony be carried
out with a view to remedy the weak-
ness revealed in the 1954 Report on
the Education of the Colony.
This motion here is what is termed
"our motion", because it concerns every-
one of us around this Table. We all
have passed through the stage from the
primary school and I guess we did not
have any hindrances when we were
going through that stage as we have
today.
An enquiry into the Education system
is long overdue Mr. President, Honour-
able Members. I can remember some
time ago a motion was moved here by
the Honourable Second Nominated Mem-
ber-I think back in 1942-asking for
this same enquiry in our primary school
education.
Now the first part of a house that is
built is the foundation. I know several
builders who go out and contract to
build large buildings and what we see
happen after a person has spent a huge
sum of money? In a few months' time
we see a big crack in the wall. That is
generally caused by the foundation.
The foundation was not well constructed
and that refers to the primary school
education in St. Vincent.
Throughout every country, the basic
economy of that country, island or state
is the primary school education. If we
have a crack in that system the whole
island or state crumbles. We all met
around this Table and I know that the
heart of every Councillor here, including
Mr. President, is willing to boost up the
moral of the standard of primary educa-
tion in St. Vincent as other islands.
Now most of us here, Mr. President,
Honourable Members, have seen and
know the dissatisfaction of the teachers
in the primary schools. Those who can
afford it generally send their children
to school in Grenada. And those who
can afford to send them to Barbados,
send them to Barbados. Those of us
who cannot afford to do that, we have
to stick it.
I was making enquiry of the Honour-
able Minister for Social Services or I
read somewhere that he has gone on a
tour of Barbados and Trinidad just to
find a means of establishing a trade
school, which was the argument of the
Honourable Acting Minister on diverse
occasions. Now, after you have sent the
Honourable Minister for Social Services
with an adviser to tour the island for a
trade school, how will that trade school
operate? It must be operated by the
teachers. And if you spend an amount
of money to build that structure and the
teachers are not satisfied the school
would be rendered useless. It wouldn't
be worth the while because throughout
the length and breadth of St. Vincent
the primary school teachers are dissatis-
fied.
Sometime ago, Mr. President-I do not
know if that letter ever reached you-
we had a little trouble with a domestic
science teacher and that teacher was
treated badly by the Education Depart-
ment. She was told by the Education
Officer when she went to have an inter-
view with him regarding some differ-
ences, to leave the premises. To leave
at once. Then he called to the Inspector
of School to get that lady off the
premises at once and that same domestic
science teacher that was sent to be train-
ed in Trinidad over a year ago she is
still teaching. She is not satisfied evi-
dently because he told this officer "Get
off my premises, Get away from here."
And she is still teaching. The Educa-
tion Officer told him to put her off the
premises. What would be the result of
that sort of thing?
Most of those things that hit the
teacher square in the face is hidden from
the Administrator, Mr. President. As
head of the state here, as Her Majesty's
representative, there are a lot of things
underneath the surface that you should
know and most of them you get on paper
and they say one thing but when you go
yourself and dig up the mechanism and
working of the system you will find
something far different from what you
have on that paper as a report. Hence,
I observe that Administrators come and
go here and most of them get bad names,
get criticized and so on but really the
Administrators does not know. I observe
that that practice has been going on for
a long time.
When we take the Education code, Mr.
President, Honourable Members, we find
there that teachers are not allowed to do
any business, absolutely no business.
Teachers are not allowed to work lands.
When we check on this report we saw
that over 75% of our teachers are receiv-
ing $108.00 per month. I don't know
how these people manage to survive up
to now. And a teacher's job is to teach
your children. They have to start from
8 to 4 and keep talking all day. How in
the life can they exist on $108 per
month? And over about 75% of them
are receiving that. The cost of living
is very high and I know that teachers
are not satisfied with the type of condi-
tions under which they have to, work.
I quote a little paragraph from Council
paper No. 19 of 1956, which says here:
"While there is evidence that con-
siderable improvement has taken
place, much has still to be done before
the education offered in the Primary
Schools can be regarded as satisfac-
tory."
That's what is written in the report for
the year 1954, Mr. President. They tell
us they need an enquiry into the educa-
tion system. It tells us right there that
it needs an enquiry and that the teach-
ers are not satisfied. And I think in
the mind of every Councillor this motion
should be well supported. Having an
enquiry into the system of Government
and the different Department of an is-
land is the best way of getting a good
Government because then the Head of
the Administration would know from an
enquiry the ills and wrongs. An enquiry
would reveal everything to you and
hence you will get a much better Gov-
ernment.
I heard sometime ago a remark here
that we would like to run this Govern-
ment as the Government of Ceylon, by
enquiries, but I think it is the best sys-
tem. A little enquiry into the system
of some of these Departments would
make your administration here much
easier because you will know everything
then.
In America they have a different form
of enquiry. Their enquiry is called
"coin your idea" and if your idea is
adaptable you will be paid for it. That's
why the American system is much easier
than ours. Here we just leave all to the
head of the Administration hence we are
going down more and more.
In our Standing Rules and Orders it
says that certificated teacher has to
work 10 years before he gets 30 weeks
leave with pay, and 5 years before he
gets 10 weeks with pay. That brings
him an old, old man. He has to work 15
years before he can get 4 months' vaca-
tion. All these things need amendment.
They bring hard pressure to bear on the
teachers hence this unsatisfactory report
we have here under review.
Unler the 42 elementary schools in
this report, 20 schools in this island are
unsatisfactory. The teachers are not
satisfied. And more, I am made to un-
derstand that they have a Teachers'
Union and it is a Registered Trade
Union. Most of the teachers of the pri-
mary school why they are so satisfied is
because most of them are local preach-
ers. They are Christians. That's why
they don't burst out. Because they
assist the Ministers of Religion taking
service. That's the reason why we
should have an Enquiry into the system
of Education and try to find out the
grievances of the teachers.
If you take some of the Government
schools here most of them have 8-900
children on their roll with an average
of over 600 and most of them are unable
to pass an entry into the Secondary
school. Not one would be able to pass
an entry into the Secondary school.
They can't pass it. Why? Because the
teachers are not satisfied.
Mr. President, Honourable Members, I
am appealing to Honourable Members
here, let us throw sentiment aside and
have an enquiry into the Education De-
partment because other than that if
things go as they are now I can tell you
it would not be long before you have
to import men here to campaign to take
our seats around this table. Because
boys and girls come out of the primary
schools just as they went in, and that
is because the teachers are not satisfied.
The basic foundation of our economy is
chalk.
Mr. President, Honourable Members, it
would not take a lot of time, we would
not go all day on this motion. It is not
enough to go all day so I would take my
seat and leave my motion to the floor.
HiONOURABLE E. T. JOSHUA: Mr. Presi-
dent, Honourable Members, I beg to
second the motion.
HONOURABLE H. F. YOUNG: Mr Presi-
dent, Honourable Members, I would like
t-) call an amendment to this motion.
The Honourable Mover can remember
very well, not too long ago, that the
Governor sent Mr. Hadley throughout
the Windward Islands in order to survey
and to make a regional approach into
our primary education. That recom-
mendation has not been published and
that is the slight amendment I want to
make to the last resolve. That the
Secretary of State be requested to ap-
prove the publication of the Hadley
Report at the earliest possible moment.
The Report, Honourable Gentlemen, I
believe when it is published, would give
you quite a lot of the background, and
quite a lot of recommendations to imple-
ment a better standard of education. If
you will accept that I shall be very glad.
That is in your last resolve.
PFESIDENT: If the Honourable Mem-
ber is going to accept that well and good
if not I shall find out if the amendment
is moved and seconded.
HON. L. C. LATHAM: I would not like
to accept that amendment.
PRESIDENT: Is that a in end mn en t
seconded?
HoN. C. L. TANNIS: Mr. President,
Honourable Members, I beg to second the
amendment moved by the Acting Minis-
ter for Social Services.
HONOURABIJE E. T. JOSHUA: On a point
of order. You asked about the accept-
ance or non acceptance of the amend-
ment, I haven't heard of that.
PRESIDENT: I asked the Honourable
Mover whether he cared to accept the
amendment that was suggested by the
Acting Minister and the Honourable
Mover declined to accept.
HONOURABLE J. A. BAYNES: Mr. Presi-
dent, Honouiable Members, this motion
in my estimation is one that needs imme-
diate attention. Because I can remenm-
uer as far back as 1952-1953, there was
a letter sent to this Government asking
for consideration of salaries of teachers.
Whether it is due to the incapability of
our teachers to seek better wages or
whether it is because a half loaf is
better than no loaf that has kept them
as dormant and as silent as they have
been for all these years.
I have realized by contact with the
many children I have met from day to
day that our primary educational system
is declining with the years. Perhaps
this might have quite a lot of causes
because I have visited several schools in
my constituency and in many cases the
help given by an inadequate staff caused
the over-crowded schools to be complete-
ly out of hand most of the day. That
is merely from observation but I believe
that there are quite a lot of causes why
our primary education is declining. The
salary of the teacher might be another
and various others but this I do know.
That our Government has been spend-
ing at an average around 7 something
per head on the primary schools as
against a much bigger sum on children
who attend a secondary school.
That as I see it, as the Mover rightly
put it, the -foundation of a house is like
the foundation of a country. It is de-
pendant on the overall intelligence of
the masses and that intelligence can
only be given a usable standard when
children are permitted to acquire the
three Rs.
In St. Vincent today right there in my
constituency at Sion Hill it is appalling
to many children you run into who are
unable to sign their names. I sign Pass-
port Forms for young people who have
I he ambition to go abroad and to en-
deavour to make tomorrow better but to
my surprise when you ask them to sign,
they say "You have to make a cross
mark for me, Sir, I can't write."
I have noticed in Grenada where that
island is in a much better position with
their primary educational system than
we are yet last week they had a meeting
there goino in to a discussion of what
can be done to improve the conditions
of the primary schools.
I think that the Mover is quite right
in endeavouring to awaken some inter-
est in bringing about a change in our
primary school system because the long-
er we allow conditions to continue the
more backward our children will be to-
morrow. And we are quite aware that
youths of today will be the men of to-
morrow. Those youths cannot be ex-
pected to exploit the most possible good
in the future if they are scholastically
unprepared.
It is quite true that many a mother
who might have the greatest ambition
for her child even in poverty finds it a
dire sacrifice to have him attend daily,
every day, primary school. But in spite
of that she makes an effort when that
effort is unable to bear fruit because of
the dissatisfaction in the rank and file
of the teachers of this island and vari-
ous other causes even the effort put out
by that mother doesn't serve any useful
purpose. And that is what we are con-
fronted with.
I know that Government has had Mr.
Hadley, the Education Officer, preparing
a report on the primary schools of the
other colonies so that some decision or
change can be arrived at here. But that
has been so long in coming. It is true
to say that our Government machinery
seems to be all heavy duty because they
grind so slow. Only the effort of a mo-
tion such as this would serve to boost
some action.
You would find that I have a file with
applications from various girls who have
been primary school pupil teachers, and
I am surprised that a lot of them haven't
got a proper hold of the actual basic
laws of the language. Hence it is true
to say that a motion such as this actually
deserves immediate attention and some
decision should be arrived at on what's
to be done so that if an Enquiry is to
be done it should be done quickly and the
necessary preparation to a better pri-
mary school approach be implemented
at the earliest possible date.
HONOURABLE E. A. C. HUGHES: Mr.
President, Honourable Members, the
issues before us today, Sirs, seem to be
quite clear and if I may say so, with all
respect, they appear also to be fairly
simple. I think there is general agree-
ment on all sides that all is not well
with the education system. And the
Honourable Mover, in the light of that
knowledge, and with some justification,
has moved for the appointment of a
Commission of Enquiry.
Now, Sir, we have been assured by the
Honourable Acting Minister for Social
Services that there is already in exist-
ence a Report which makes certain re-
commendations, which recommendations
presumably have the avowed object of
improving that system of education. It
seems to me that if there is a possibility
of obtaining early, and when I say early
I mean immediate, release of that Re-
port, it would be rather a waste of time
in the meantime to proceed to set up a
Commission of Enquiry to examine that
same system which is dealt with by the
Hadley Report, when in fact the Hadley
Report may prove acceptable not only to
the Honourable Mover and the Honour-
able Member who supported this motion
but to the teachers who are the people
really concerned and who are the people
whose cause the Honourable Mover ap-
pears to be championing.
Now it may be that this Hadley Report
may be acceptable to all those Gentle-
men in which event we shall have wasted
time, by proceeding to set up a Commis-
sion in addition to the Report that has
already been written. On the other
hand, it is quite possible that the Hadley
Report may not be acceptable. It is
quite possible, I won't say probable, that
nothing will be accepted. In which case
what have we lost by waiting 6 or 8
weeks? And that, as I see it, is based on
the immediate publication of the Hadley
Report.
If when it is published, the Honour-
able Mover finds that the recommenda-
tions which we are assured it contains
do not fill the bill and cannot fill the
bill, then surely it will be up to him with
more justification to say "well we have
this statement. It is a mere piece of
paper which does not assist education
one jot. We do not accept it. Let us
proceed and have our Commission", but
there is also the possibility as I say on
the other hand that he may find it a
worthwhile and a valuable document
which will meet the case which he is try-
ing to put forward. In which event,
will we not have rather prejudiced our-
selves in advance of the publication of
this Report by saying "Well, regardless
of whether that Hadley Report is worth
the paper it is written on or not, regard-
less of whether it is good or bad or
indifferent, we are going to have a Com-
mission of Enquiry?
Surely we realise that if it is agreed to
appoint a Commission of Enquiry this
same Government which is reported to
grind exceedingly slowly, and I may re-
mind him that those mills that grind
exceedingly slow also grind exceedingly
small, and perhaps get greater results
in the long run, that same Government
would not be able to produce a Commis-
sion and have it sit and have it report
in the pace of 6 or 8 weeks. I think we
know from experience if we are going to
have a Commission of Enquiry under
the Commissions of Enquiry laws there
would be a delay of not less than 6 to 8
months before that Commission could
report. Are we going to be prejudiced
in any way by holding up this matter,
seeing whether we can get urgent and
immediate publication of the Hadley Re-
port so that we can decide then in ad-
vance whether this Report is good? In
which case we will accept it and work on
it in order to try and improve the system
or whether the Report is bad. In which
case we will throw it into the waste
paper basket and insist that we must
have a Commission of Enquiry.
I am just trying to avoid the duplica-
tion of the proceedings. I would hate
to see the Hadley Report acceptable to
every one but at the same time a Com-
mission of Enquiry sitting to pass on and
make recommendations on the very sub-
ject that has already been dealt with by
the Hadley Report.
HONOURABLE E. T. JOSHUA: Mr. Presi-
dent, Honourable Gentlemen, I sat here
and only rise at a certain time to second
this motion so ably moved with the hope
that by now I would have heard some
debate on the fundamental meaning 'of
that motion moved by the Member for
South Windward but I have not heard
that yet.
I see a clever move. But a motion of
this kind being opposed by this Govern-
ment would cause a furore in this coun-
try but I see a tactical amendment by
the government side to amend for the
Hadley Report. It is that some of us
would be glad that the present educa-
tional system continue; some of us would
be glad that the ignorance of this
country remains constant so that the
semi-wise or wise profit ad infinitum
from the state of affairs of things in this
country.
I am afraid going through these Re-
ports from 1950 on Education today so
far as the last report is concerned, I am
afraid-as I told the Honourable Mover
in a whisper just now "do not accept the
amendment let them oppose the motion"
--from these reports what the Hadley
Report would be. Because if we read
carefully these Reports we can see that
from the level of these Reports the Had-
ley Report cannot think above them.
That is to say, a 2 or 3-gallon bucket can-
not hold 5 gallons of water and of course
the scope and magnitude of a country's
education gives that country the where-
withal by which it can get equilibrium to
all your industrial economic circumstan-
ces to which sometimes we give so much
vocal expressions.
I will deal first of all Mr. President,
Honourable Members, not with teachers'
grouses or anything of the type as yet
but with the fundamental basic expres-
sions made in Educational Reports from
time to time here. When you look,
Gentlemen. or if you study these Reports
at all, from 1950 up to the last one
published that caused the Honourable
Mover concern and perhaps this com-
munity, those who had any interest at
all in the educational fabric and progress
of our country, you will find that these
Reports are only duplications, each Re-
port becomes a duplication with very few
minor additions, obvious additions, to
those stereotype settings of the Report
but one, the one before.
It's really ridiculous when we sit and
read these Reports that we sit here and
still insist to talk advancement, to talk
progress, when in truth and in fact as
the Member for St. George has said the
quality, I have proved that, the quality
of the elementary students now leaving
school is so slight that although they
have left school in a standard it shows
us that they cannot with any justifica-
tion hold any minor jobs when it comes
to 'display that intellectual bearing as
in the day when the Mover's father,
Members' fathers, my father, were in
those same elementary schools.
What we lose sight of Mr. President,
Honourable Members, is this: the econo-
mic condition becomes so acute, whereas
half-penny was needed to be spent it
actually needs 5d. in its place. But the
age is so hurrying where all governments
having a race for war implements, the
economic, basic conditions of housing,
food, must go down down to the vile dust
while we spend seven-eights of the
revenue all over the world for war.
That's the reason for the pitch, economic
condition of this country. We are sub-
ject peoples to power who must inevitably
enter the race and the repercussion of
such a race will be felt keenly in all
these lands.
If we turn to the Report for 1950, and
I have a few of them here. First of all
it speaks of an Historical background on
education. And if you look at the Edu-
cation Report for 1952, it refers to this
Report in the following terms:
"For an account of the development
of education prior to 1952 the reader
is referred to the Annual Reports :fJ
1950 and 1949".
What is this historical report? A stereo-
type, actually meaningless, a piece of
rhetoric pertaining to historical back-
ground of education in this country.
Then that is referred to this and to that
and so it goes on. Well, no wonder this
country presents such a cruel picture.
If we lack the refined things of life the
principal of which is education you must
be cruel and hard hearted These are
the sentiments when you see them play-
ing their part. It reflects on the very
fundamental principles of your country,
the basic of which is education and en-
lightenment. The very word come from
the Latin 'ed' and 'duco', leading out.
leading out of what? I presume from
darkness into light.
The question is, Gentlemen, when you
look at this Report for 1950 and when
you turn to page 7 you find written
there:
'Inspection.
During 1950 a formal inspection of
each elementary school was made; by
the Inspector of Schools for the pur-
pose of placing each school in its grade
of efficiency as required by the exist-
ing regulations. This is in addition to
the normal visits or inspection.
Work in the Schools
The standard of performance is
generally speaking low. Greater at-
tention needs to be paid to English
and arithmetic. The teaching of his-
tory and geography is poor consisting
mostly of a hodge podge of miscellane-
ous and unrelated facts. Much of the
difficulty resides in the lack of suitable
texts books. There is a tendency to
overcrowdc the curriculum with sub-
jects. Subjects such as Elementary
Science and Nature Study are purely
"book" subjects-practical work being
nearly non-existent."
That statement shows, as the Honour-
able Member referred to the 1954 Report,
that not one change has been made in
education from this 1950 Report to the
1955 Report. It is clear that not an
iota of change has been made because
the same things has appeared. If you
turn to this Report of which the Honour-
able Member complains bitterly, if he
had time or perhaps he had time to
scrutinise preceding Reports as the one
he looked through.
There was reference made to the work
and there we have "Work in Schools" in
that Report for 1954:--
"There are indications of improve-
ment in spite of the many difficulties
that exist."
"in spite of the many difficulties that
exist." But what are these improve-
ments? When you turn to page 4 of the
1954 Report on Education, this is what
is the improvement:-
"The examination results for 1952-54
are as follows:-
Year
1952
No.
Entered
305
No.
Passed
92
Percentage
30.2 "
That's the improvement of which this
Report speaks. You go up to the year
1953, you have 284 students entered for
the examination overall and you have
90 passes. That is 31.7%. That is the
improvement of which this Report
speaks-over the one for 1950 and so it
goes on.
Mr. President, Honourable Members, I
will go a little deeper than the mere
pecuniary side of this motion before this
House and we will be convinced beyond
measure that merely to wait here to see
what Hadley Report means is a waste of
time also. Whether we duplicate our
efforts or not the duplication would be
in the favour of a Commission being
appointed.
We have according to the Report when
in a Budget Session when we replied
here to the speech from the throne, His
Honour the Administrator Walter Flem-
ing Coutts, there was for the first time
a barrage of attack on the educational
system of the country in that Budget
Session but we notice that they stop
giving you in the Report-the section of
the report is left out-the amount of
children for whom education is provided.
They used to tell you clear 62% of the
children are provided with education.
That is to say because you have been
seeing that 38 children out of every 100
growing up ignorant every year you cut
that out of the Report. That stereo-
type patch is taken out.
It is clear that if you turn to thee
Registrar General's Report, and I have
two of his Reports here-1952 and 1953
of the Registrar General's Reports-we
find that the child population of this
country range on an average from 1949,
1950, 1951, 1952, 1953-30,476, 31,490,
32,190, 32,800, 33,480, of course with the
successive rise of population. But if we
look at the Report for 1950 the number
of children enrolled was 13,591 and dur-
ing those years 62% they say was provi-
ded with education. That is to say,
spaces for those were provided for. But
when we check we cannot survey these
reports properly save and except we re-
vert to the Registrar of Births and
Deaths against statistics set out in those
reports, then we will find that over 50%
of the children of this country are with-
out educational facilities at all. In
these reports in 1952 it was 13,464 provi-
ded for, while in 1952 the educatable
population of the country was 32,800. In
1953, 14,925 was provided for whereas
the educatable population of the coun-
try was 33,480. It is a very peculiar
thing. The average aggregate reflects
one statement repeated in each Educa-
tion Report in parrotlike precision when
it is said here-take the last one perhaps
we may find the parrot like statement
there, and there it is:
"Education is not compulsory."
You can pick up any of them, close your
eyes and look at the front page.
"Education is not compulsory. It
would be impossible to enforce any
such regulation owing to lack of ac-
commodation."
Gentlemen, to bear out what I am
saying, take another Report at random.
Year in year out you have here the same
repeated refrain. 5, it only changes it's
number. No, it hasn't even changed its
number, paragraph 5 in the Reports we
have here. But when we examine that
statement this is what we see.
We have seen that although no facili-
ties can be offered in place of a compul-
sory system of education yet when we
look at the figures given in those Re-
ports we find that the average attend-
ance for the year, when 13,950 is provi-
ded for we have 8,900 attending school.
When 14,926 are provided for you have
10,202. Yet we are told year in year out
in Education Reports no form of compul-
sory education can be implemented, not
even to get those who are to fill those
places to come in because it is quite clear
they say education is free not compul-
sory. In other words, in a country
where there is more temptation to work
children, to work children, than to have
the schooled because it is a raw, naked
agricultural country with one of the low-
est standards of the world-when we say
the lowest standards we mean when it
comes to our intellectual bearing here-
the temptation is to have children going
to the fields rather than to the schools.
Therefore, when we repeat in parrotlike
precision in these Reports year in year
out, it is impossible to implement com-
pulsory education because the schools
would not be available to house the
population. That's a repeated state-
ment which tells us that if no form or
no effort is made to do something to the
very fabric, the very foundation of a
state education we cannot get too very
far. Not only would we be the laughing
stock but we would have to bear the
burden, we will be the fool side of a
federation if we make no effort to edu-
cate the nation.
I notice that when we compare the
figures of the Registrar General and take
the Reports we see how deep the gulf is
between the child or educatable popula-
tion of the country and the amount
who are actually getting education in
schools. When we summarise that we
find, Mr. Speaker, Honourable Members,
that who so ever will may come. The
conditions under which the education
system of this country is systematised
gives a teacher the feeling that if so
much children didn't come today how
happy it would be because my class
would be less complicated. I would be
having less worries. I would be having
a smaller classroom to contend with.
Gentlemen, those are the conditions
from time immemorial in your country
that existed here. It became more acute
as the population began rapidly to rise,
therefore, it is quite clear then that if
the population of this country is rising
It should be the dire concern of this
Government to tackle fairly and square-
ly the educational problem of the land.
The Hadley Report as I told you and by
which a fine get away from an Enquiry
was made-and of course you can en-
force that because you are in the majori-
ty and merely so but you cannot always
have things that we want to have. We
will one day have to have respect for the
country's opinions, and what is to the
poor In this country.
The question is that we see no way to
oppose so able a motion. We have seen
from the very Reports written that the
Reports themselves are telling us that
there is no educational system in the
country and from what you see here that
is what you have to base your hypothesis
for reconstructing the whole fabric of
the educational life of this country.
Well, if they are telling us if the Hadley
Reports deemed already Hadley Reports
-let us see who signed them. They are
signed, yes "C. V. D. Hadley, Education
Officer, September 1951". Look how long
he has been signing these Reports. Well
then this grand Report that we believe
has the elexir for the educational system
to come when you read all these Reports,
and I tell you, Gentlemen, let me repeat
'a three gallon bucket cannot hold five,
it will run over', if this is the reflection
of what is to be envisioned for a recast
and revolutionisation of the educational
system of this country. Some sometimes
speak of little bamboo tents; some some-
times speak of little this and that but I
speak today of an educational system.
That whether it is adapted now, whether
you are prepared to take the plunge now
and begin to educate the people of the
country you would have to do it some
time to come and when you should
have taken your places here and just
being prejudiced opposing a motion for
the fun of opposing motions and didn't
see you have been opposing the country's
wills, everything for want of a shilling
you must die or the thing must be
choked into oblivion, these types of be-
haviour are now becoming too prevalent,
too near apart.
We should now refer to the secondary
cost of education as opposed to the pri-
mary cost and examine how these costs
are made up. In 1950, it is said in the
1950 Report that the cost per child in the
primary school amounted to $15.52,
whereas the cost per child in the second-
ary school amounted to $37.40. But in
1953, the amount per child in the pri-
mary school amounted to $23.99 whereas
in the secondary school it was $75.46.
What does that tell us? How this cost
per unit or per child is increased? It is
increased in this fashion.
If we look at the Estimates of the
Colony we see Personal Emoluments,
Other Charges. If 56 is added to the
teachers' salary well, of course, the sum
total of all the teachers are added up,
divided by the number of children and
then you get the cost per child. Do you
think that is a fair way of obtaining the
value of the cost per child? Well, if we
had to put in there the value of the
school, if we had to place there the value
of the equipment that this report criti-
cised when a motion was brought here
to change the text books of the schools,
you heard nothing of that motion. The
very Report is telling us of suitable text
books. That motion was moved in this
House by the Member for North Wind-
ward in 1952, and this is a Report of
1950. If we come here when these Re-
ports are laid as Council Papers we
throw them aside in the waste paper
basket and never read them or if we read
them and didn't care to know the con-
tents it will only mean that we will be
putting things there to show you well
let us make the Report'clearly and let
the Members see and if they want to do
anything about it they do.
So then you will see they tell you here
about the defects, clearly stated, in the
1950 Report on Education. But up to
1954 instead of our seeing some form of
improvements we see worse than what
presents itself. The rising cost per child
doesn't mean anything when it comes to
the basic benefit received as per that
cost expended on the child. Another
part again, Honourable Gentlemen. You
know into season and out of season,
every Budget Session when we are doing
the Estimates, the vexed question was to
get better inspection in the schools.
Every year or every Budget Session when
we begin to cut to the bones the first
thing you gone to cut down is education,
cut off an Inspector of Schools. Every
time you want pruning you look with an
envious eye towards the education of the
children of the State. And now you
have in these Reports a statement made
in one inspection and that was only
necessary, an official inspection just to
grade and to give the effic ency bar.
The police get the efficiency bor.
I heard the Honourable Mo
in his notes, and I shall nov
them. He referred to the
Teachers cannot acquire land!
er that is attempted or not I s
a passing glance. Teachers I
as prisoners not even as good
men. Policemen to lock up a
that crimes do not take p
teacher is there to raise the mil
sana in corpore santo" to app
you have a higher citizen an
enlightened mind, but you are
that policemen can take land
tate, plant them in cane and (
like that, arrowroot and every
that, and a school teacher i
down. Do you not see then it'
if you might infer from th,
statement to discourage the tE
all respects? What does it :
What is the price? A vast an
terates in the country so that
your governing better?
You remember a Senior memi
House speaking to the Gove
Commander in Chief when he,
in here, I remember this state
thought, we thought that bI
them ignorant we would gov
better but we now find ourselves
more gaols than schools. This
of the Budget Debate that I r
in the earlier part of my add]
we prefer protection of the Sta
prisons, legal Department,
Magistracy. "Justice is not a
virtue". Those are the deba
which we show much these wil
when we view slightly the e(
system of any country.
Some of our people in the
part of this country and than
place but due to enlightment,
ing, the school is there but ow
overcrowding nature of the sc
task of the teacher in this tro
he would like to see even thosi
come in stay out to give more
more comfort. And that's h
rer to say
examine
fact that
i. Wheth-
hall make
hen seem
as police-
nd to see
ace. The
ids "mens
mar where
a more
selling me
from es-
verything
thing like
so kept
i a design
, Mover's
achers in
)rofit us?
ny of llli-
you make
>er of this
rnor and
vas sworn
ment, we
Keeping
ern them
s building
was part
-ferred to
*ess when
te, police,
Judiciary,
cloistered
es under
1 increase
ucational
remotest
any othea
no school-
[ng to the
shools the
pical sun,
, who can
room and
aman nar
ture. Then "you tell us in these Reports
in the parrotlike statements year in year
out no form of compulsory education,
not even to protect those whom space is
provided for. Your name is on the roll
but if you had come out else we know
why you didn't come out. Once you
come you must remain there. Not even
that form of compulsory education,
Gentlemen? No, the benefit that would
be derived to assuage the ignorance of
our people and that they should be
proud to do and eager to do.
It is that do not you believe that when
they are ignorant you govern them bet-
ter. You will'have more trouble and the
amount would be inevitably spent. While
we can't even get a telephone system,
one of the greatest provocation you have
in St. Vincent at present is to go to a
telephone and try to talk to any part of
this country, but yet the same amount
that bought electrical equipment -and
wireless equipment for the police could
have already given us a telephone sys-
tem. That's to show you how keen you
have to fight when you allow people to
be in a country without even caring how
they live, how their social surroundings
are, without even spending a few cents
in the same school building to give them
a little lessons for that which they
didn't have in earlier part of their life.
Nothing at all. We close our eyes to
those things. The money is still spent.
You never save anything. Fate and re-
tribution never show us where that sav-
ing is when it comes to the depriving of
the subjects in any state. You must
spend it somewhere or the other, there
is no saving at all.
According to the things repeated by
the Honourable Mover, I now come to
assess one or two points of it so that I
might adopt the Honourable Second
Nominated Member's words "Amen",
but I never take an education issue
lightly. I never treat an education issue
lightly. I treat it according to my own
mentality, my own ideas and the ideas
of all educationalists and all people who
are informed. The teachers might be
disgruntled but this is the statement
made. If we didn't want to teach our
own people for nothing so much the bet-
ter let them grow up ignorant so there-
fore then the teachers have to console
themselves with the fact that it is their
own people they are teaching. If they
were having to teach European children
well then they may have been consider-
ed, let us go step by step because we
want our children to be properly edu-
cated, then you must pay the teachers.
They are not European children. They
go to' England. If their fathers and
mothers even work here, they go to
England to be educated and to places all
about the place. And those who are well
to do, they send their children to Lodge
Schools in Barbados and Harrison Col-
lege and the rest. So what do they care
to argue here in favour of who depend-
ing on the country's education? Are
they going to make them clever that
when the rest stick their hands in their
eyes they may see clearly? It would
have been foolish I wouldn't have com-
mit them to that.
I am tempted to sit down because I
know I like when I move a motion to
sum it up again because I am not going
to satisfy the Honourable Second Nomi-
nated Member's request.
Teachers not allowed to work lands.
That is true. So therefore the Mover
wants to tell us clearly that he cannot
even supplement that which should be
supplemented, the meagre salary. 20
schools are unsatisfactory. I do not
think definitely it is due to the melinger-
ing of the teachers. If you place square
pegs in round holes, the pegs will either
get round to suit the holes or the holes
wil? inevitably get square to suit the
pegs. Therefore we import men or make
a makeshift condition here to suit our
repeated refrain: "no money". This is
a most peculiar and unfortunate coun-
try. When any effort to do anything at
all that is fundamental, no money, and
we inevitably do something that takes
more money than if we had manfully
faced the problem and do it once and
for all. That is our grief here. We try
to make shifts and in the makeshift
arrangement we spend twice as much
than we would have otherwise spent.
Either bad economy or short sightedness
of the spenders. So then the motion
seems to pdint and let me make it clear
as I haven't seen the motion put to this
House in a way that all parts of it:
"Whereas the Education Report for
the Colony for the year 1954 which was
recently released shows that the stand-
ard of attainment of the majority of
Primary Schools in the Colony is un-
satisfactory."
This tells us that 20,000,000 Frenchmen
cannot be wrong. If all, as it happened
two years ago, two examinations ago, all
the children actually failed in the pri-
mary schools. Well, 20,000,000 French-
men were proven to be wrong, that it
wasn't the system. Why it was? It
shows that the curriculum of the coun-
try is either too high in attainment or
that the subjects taught in the schools
were not the subjects that the Examiner
took. In other words a higher standard
was envisaged by the Examiners and a
lower standard aimed at by the schools.
We have to take it for that. Those are
our assumptions. But, Gentlemen, any
set of men, any community that is alive,
any civilised state can see that some-
thing is radically wrong with the educa-
tional system of this country. Even in
the schools, it may not be a question
merely of money because you may give
somebody money and do them a favour
that is worth twice the value of the
money you give them.
The way in which teachers are being
moved about this country, before a
teacher can get to know the children of
a district they are being moved. It's
not like a police even. That a police
may get acquainted with the people for
one thing or the other. Before they can
get acquainted with the children so that
they know them, know their idiosyncra-
cles, know their every ways to smooth
the cares and meet the parents, they are
moved. And of course like a little mad
house you see this thing turning up
itself. These batch of teachers pitched
to the Leeward, shortly after they are
pitched to the Windward and so on.
Well, then you enter and before you can
settle ddwn to kndw your area you find
yourself drifting to another part. You
go under the feelings that you have been
removed perhaps as you call it in com-
mon vernacular spite or dashed away in
the bush. Those things affect adversely
the educational structure of any country.
When you are far removed from your
home the kind of things that can go on
in your own area are gone.
They say that when you are in your
own area you may malinger. Who told
you that? That is why we ask that the
school should be properly inspected and
proper educationalists be appointed so
that they can do more in the school and
set a standard there. But it wasn't done
because we thought that when we prune
budgets we must look and cut away
all the strings that could prop to support
education or the corollaries thereto.
Well, what you expect to happen? It
isn't like seeing a building put up-
Ministries. It isn't like seeing something
built, nice market. It's hidden in the
cranium. No one can see it. So there-
fore since it cannot be seen, this thing
we call education, short-sighted people
generally overlook it. Well, we hope
that this motion, the second resolve of
which refers to the dissatisfaction of the
teachers:
"AND WHEREAS there is obvious dis-
satisfaction"
Sure there would be. If you have no
reason in even treating the teachers of
the school, taking them up and dashing
them where you like without a reason or
cause or complaint and most teachers
have heard it but I sometimes keep cer-
tain complaints away because to try to
bail the sea with a bucket that has holes
is not a Herculean task but a wicked
task.
"AND WHEREAS there is obvious dis-
satisfaction among the Rank and File
of the Primary School Teachers, hence
the very unsatisfactory result in the
schools as pointed out in the report
under review."
Naturally, if teachers are expected to
move by command well they move by
command. If teachers are the intelli-
gensia of the country and you find they
are treated as police men, well it would
mean that if you treat your intelligent
body of men and women in that fashion
well you are only obviously trying to
circumvent, to make the educational
structure dwindle and your cost per unit
of child may expand as much as you like.
Save and except that money is spent
with reason in this country, these types
of complaints will always be before this
House. It is for us to rectify them,
Gentlemen.
It's a pity to say, the people put us
here, whether we be Ministers or Priests
we are all placed here by the wills of the
people. The nominated Members have
an excuse. They are placed by a fiat of
the Government. Nobody put them here
but the Governmnt itself and if that is
so, if we sit here and try to twist a well
founded motion full well knowing what
we can envisage and sitting like a hen
on its eggs, it's testimony to tell us that
those eggs are spoilt long since. And we
have before us a state of affairs that
needs enquiry.
A Nominated Member, the last time we
held a sitting here, said, What, you
going to have Government by Commis-
sion? We have to have Governments by
Commissions when a Government be-
haves like this.
"BE IT RESOLVED that a Commission
be appointed at the earliest possible
date and the necessary enquiry into
the Education system of the Colony be
carried out....'
The First Nominated Member referred
to the fact that it would be a waste of
time if the Hadley Report proved that
it has a wealth of compensation there
for all disgruntled teachers as the mo-
tion tells us.
I have argued on this motion in this
House in such a manner as to show you
this enquiry has nothing to do with this
Report, because if so you wouldn't be
here. In an instant you begin to say
we cannot implement it it would take
too much millions to implement this,
rest it aside there, but at the same time
we will have had an enquiry. We will
have had an -enquiry into which the
14
Secretary of State is bound to be ap-
prised. And after all I cannot no longer
close my eyes and hide behind the Min-
isters or the Ministry of St. Vincent; I
cannot any longer hide behind an ad-
ministration, the world is surging into
light, and in our domains in the farflung
areas we still see signs of total illiteracy
existing there, we must do something
about it. So if natives of that very
country set apart themselves to put on
roads and try to pull back the education-
al advancement of their own country,
let them do it. They can do it with in-
dignity by moving counter motions.
PRESIDENT: The Honourable Minister
has not got the right to speak now but
I shall call on him later to reply to the
debate.
HONOURABLE A. C. CYRUS: Mr. Presi-
dent, the Honourable Mover of this mo-
tion said that I moved a similar motion
in 1942, but it was in 1952. It was in
1952 that I moved a similar motion. As
a matter of fact, the Education Report
at that time amazed almost all the think-
ing people of the community, when I
read it I felt that I was in a strategic
position to give help in this matter, and
the best service I thought I could give to
the community was to move a motion
asking for an Enquiry into the Educa-
tional system with a view to making bet-
ter the educational condition as obtained
in those years. The motion was passed
and on later enquiry I was told it was
sent up to the Comptroller in Barbados,
and he was to send down his Educationa-
al Adviser, Mr. Nichols, to go into the
matter. What happened to Mr. Nichols
I don't know. I never heard anything
more of him. I don't know if the mo-
tion was also sent to the Governor of
the Windward Islands, Sir Robert Arun-
dell, but in his last message in the Wind-
ward Islands he did say that a survey
must be carried out in the Windward
Islands because we were not getting
enough for the money we were paying
for education. Shortly after, a body of
men including Members of the Legislative
Council, comprised this survey and we
met here quite a lot of times aAd had
some dog fights over different things and
what not. Afterwards I heard that a
Report was made. That was in 1953.
This is 1950. Because I am interested
in education when I passed through
Grenada last year I enquired about this
thing because at that time I thought it
was long overdue for publication, I got
a hazy reply. It seemed to me as if the
Governor had not yet seen it although it
was something written so long ago per-
haps it is not yet sent to the Secretary
of State.
I have made repeated enquiries about
this Report, I have not heard anything
that I can go in. I don't know if the
Secretary of State has a copy or what.
I therefore think that this is quite a
reasonable debate. The Government
have made a motion asking for an
amendment to this motion but it seems
to me that the Government themselves
are satisfied that all is not well with the
educational system of St. Vincent. Well,
then it boils down to this. The question
is not whether there should be an en-
quiry, the question that we have before
this House, I maintain, is as to whether
we should have an enquiry or we should
wait on the publication of this Hadley
Report. I am saying quite frankly that
I have lost faith in that Report. I don't
know what has become of it. I don't
know if we will ever hear anything more
of it, and I think as the old people's
saying goes "while the grass is growing
the horse is starving". Children are be-
coming too old to go to school and a lot
of them funny things are happening.
And as members have pointed out, the
fabric of intelligence in the primary
school iT reducing and becoming very
thin, and it is the concern of everybody
in the community to see that something
is done. I wish I could persuade my
colleagues to vote for an enquiry so that
we can see what is wrong.
If you go down the street you will see
at the Methodist School some children
are under the belfry, some in the yard
and all different parts. What happens
when it rains I do not know. It seems
to me as if they are overcrowded. And
all the other schools are alike. Well,
don't you see that there is need for im-
mediate solution to this problem? It
isn't something we can make slight, of
It is bad. It will be a boomerang. If we
don't' take this thing serious there will
be repercussions. I am going to end my
debate with the very quotation that I
used when I spoke here in 1952, I got the
words from John Bright who said
"The nation of every country dwells
in its cottages and its hovels and un-
less the light of your education can
reflect in those cottages you have yet
to learn the duties of Government."
Gentlemen, let us do something quickly
so that the light of this Council can
reflect on a man in his humble home so
that as a result society would benefit
from it.
HONOURABLE R. E. BAYNES: Mr. Presi-
dent, Honourable Members, when one
really sits in his chair and listens to
such quotations made by the last Speak-
er I am tempted to base my contribu-
tion on a quotation which said-
"No doubt the sovereignty of man
lieth hid in knowledge, wherein many
things are reserved which Kings with
their treasures cannot buy nor with a
force command."
Now, after listening here to all the de-
bates and reading the Report here on
the Education Department, there is no
doubt that there is room for all the
parties. The question at stake is not
the educational fabric, the question at
stake is whether we should have an
enquiry or whether we should make a
desperate effort to get the Hadley Report
and, if possible, implement it.
Now, like the last speaker, I was a
Member of that Body which carried out
that Commission of Enquiry into the
Educational system of St. Vincent, and I
say this that every cross-section of this
community was represented at that En-
quiry. The teachers were present, the
local Committee, the Members of the
schools were all present and everybody
made their contribution to that Report.
Some of the other islands, which I am
told have seen it and others have in
part implemented it and lauded the Re-
port very highly. It is unfortunate that
St. Vincent, because of being a grant-
aided country, has not seen it. There
may be some parts of it that may be
quite suitable to our educational system.
The question is whether we should have
a Commission of Enquiry or whether to
press for the Hadley Report. My opinion
is that this Legislative Body should
press desperately to get the Report and
examine it because we are going to carry
out a Commission of Enquiry when we
have not seen the Hadley report. I have
not seen it, and as far as I know the
points on which we have agreed upon
are similar to the points w re debating
here.
Even the Education Officer who has
prepared this Report has put it in such
a way that he is telling you that he
realizes the necessity for adjusting the
educational system. If that was not the
case he would have put it in such a way
that you would believe all is well. What
your argument is based on is a result of
what he has put here and in one point
what was made here, he has stressed the
necessity for the practical application
of the educational system in St. Vincent.
All that you have is purely theoretical
and as one Member always said, you are
not fitting the people who are sent to the
primary schools for the responsibilities
of life. You teach him to read and very
often as soon as that boy has reached
the third standard of the primary
school because of economic pressure he
has to leave school and very often he
forgets even to write his name. What
are we going to do? Just to duplicate
something that has already been done.
I sat on that Committee and I can tell
you a number of people, some whom you
see in this very chamber, sat on that
Committee. A number of people sat on
that Committee, and I think really that
it will be just duplicating what has
already been done.
HONOURABLE L. C. LATHAM: On a point
of correction. I heard the Honourable
Member say he sat on that Committee.
What Committee? The Hadley Report?
HONOURABLE R. E. BAYNES: Exactly,
the Report of Mr. Hadley is not just
Mr. Hadley's Report. It's a Report of a
Committee of which Mr. Hadley was the
Chairman. That's how it was done in
every island. It is not Mr. Hadley's -Re-
port. There were a number of papers
submitted and different points brought
to bear and for weeks this Committee
sat in this very Chamber. On some oc-
casions the Crown Attorney took the
chair, on others the Education Officer
when he was in the land, and it took
several weeks to prepare the findings on
which the Report is prepared. What are
we going to do? Duplicate that?
My opinion is that we should stress
the point that the Report by Mr Hadley
should be released. It is not the Govern-
ment of St. Vincent holding it up as one
Member said. The Government them-
selves are greatly concerned about the
educational system, and if you read the
Report here-I am reading .a part which
the Honourable Member for North Wind-
ward quoted except that he didn't quote
the last line when has said in 1952, 92
passed out of 305 in 1953, 90 passed
31.7%, 1954-170 passed which really did
show a slight measure of improvement.
But this is not sufficient to really justify
that all is well in the Education Depart-
ment. I am going to agree with him
very strongly on that particular point
because when you go on further you read
in Government schools, that at one time
lead the way in educational development
in St. Vincent, are quite away on the
last page. We come down to "(E) Un-
satisfactory.
Brighton Methodist, which at one time
used to supply quite a lot of bright
fellows from the country.
"Calliaqua Anglican
Dorsetshire Hill Government
Chateaubelalir Methodist
Colonarie Roman Catholic
Kingstown Anglican"
This is silly. And that in itself will tell
you what is really taking place, not only
in the educational system but in the
schools themselves. Nobody can sit here
and blind their eyes to this but you have
to think in terms of whether you are
making this a political issue or you are
getting down to the seriousness of devel-
opment of the country. That is one.
And whether you are going to have any
Commission of Enquiry cost money, and
every Commission of Enquiry regardless
of the findings can only be implemented
on the recommendation of the Governor.
We happen to know that. They can only
be implemented on the recommendation
of the Governor. Then if you really did
carry out a Commission of Enquiry and
you got the findings, what are you going
to do? Tell me, can you implement
them? The same thing all over again
and let us not duplicate work that has
already been done.
Now so far as the teachers are con-
cerned. The teachers themselves sat on
that Committee representing their case
and apart from that a Special Commit-
tee went into the teachers' case and re-
commended several grades of pay for
them, a long grade and a short grade for
teachers. It is unfortunate that the
Government of St. Vincent did not imple-
ment it, but to be really a little political,
who is responsible for implementing
these recommendations when they come
up in the estimates? Finance Commit-
tee, isn't it?
Finance Committee is responsible for
approving or disapproving these recom-
mendations. If they are put down in
the estimates and you realise that you
haven't got sufficient revenue to take
care of these recommendations you say
well we cannot carry it. We want roads
in this area, we want roads here, we
want development here. We got to be
reasonable. Let us not put motions here
without examining whether they can be
implemented, yes or no? The teachers
have a very strong case and I am pre-
pared to back them 100% because I feel
that they are underpaid. And I say
this that whether Members of Council
in the Legislative group believe it or not
they have the utmost support here from
the Members of this Government. And
apart from that, when they got up and
said that we are asking you if you would
amend this motion because we are in
sympathy with you because the whole
thing should be attended to, then It gives
the impression that we are in direct
opposition but we feel that the best ap-
proach to this right now is not to bring
forward a Commission of Enquiry but to
make drastic effort, make as much noise
as you can to see that the Report is
released and published, and if the Report
doesn't suit you then we are agreed 100%
that we implement another Commission
of Enquiry.
HONOURABLE S. E. SLATER: Mr. Presi-
dent, Honourable Members, while I have
listened to some of the Honourable
Gentlemen asking for one thing and
giving another thing or in other words
want this Commission of Enquiry and do
not want it. I feel that if this Commis-
sion of Enquiry was carried out here by
all these Judges and Doctors, and Magis-
trates and all the rest of it, I don't see
why with all the debate that has taken
place this Enquiry could not have been
implemented or something being pub-
lished for the information of the citizens
concerned.
I have been asking myself for over two
or three years about this Enquiry and
what took place on it and in the Social
Services Committee that was the talk in
every meeting. Where is this Report?
Nobody seems to know where it is. The
thing is so strange. If this Report was
comprised of our people here, belong-
ing to St. Vincent. I do not see
why it should be sitting in Grenada
because if Grenada was enquiring into
something the Report would not have
come here. It is true the Governor is
there but this is a Report that was more
or less caused to be given to this island.
HONOURABLE R. E. BAYNME: On a point
of order. The Report was not only on
behalf of St. Vincent it was on the WI&-
ward Islands.
PRESIDENT: That's not on a point of
order.
HONOURABLE R. E. BAYWES: A point 6t
correction.
HONOuRABLi S. E. SLATER Se it sW br
not it is more or less started here by so
many -people. I want to find out since
that is so and so many people sat on it
whether it is top heavy that is all I want
to find out. And snece that is so it is
so long waiting you cannot give any rea-
son why or you cannot say when this
Report will be released, well why not
implement now ,1 ab this motion calls
for? It is not asking for anything extra.
You can still have this Commission of
Enquiry here with our local people for
St. Vincent and thcb,: would not cost so
much. Since you al: were capable of
sitting on this one for the Windwards
I think you can sil on your own and find
out what was.; wron : to assist in making
everything easier "or all concerned.
Therefore, I don't 1:elieve i.f you wait
now for another two years you would be
doing any good to St. Vincent. Since it
was not released all this time no one
knows when it will be. And what are
we waiting for? For another two years
to elapse before we know what's happen-
ing?
Gentlen-en, I am supporting this mo-
tion and I believe this enouiy is neces-
sary. As the Second Nominated Member
said the Cnveu'-r :'rcaca.sted on the
Windward Island;i that it is necessary
for an Enquiry into education in these
parts. I think it is necessary for us to
have an Enquiry here. I believe quite
a lot of good would be derived from it.
Since that is so I am prepared to support
this motion as it stands.
HONOURABLE C. L. TANNINS: Mr. Presi-
dent, Honourable Members This is a
motion as it stands before us here asking
for a Cornmissicn o' Enquiry to te set up.
In the first place let us be reasonable.
Our financial positi '. n is of such that
every .item of expenditure which has to
take its place now must go back to the
Secretary of State for approval. When
you set up a Commission of Enquiry we
would have to get the approval of the
Secretary of State to allow you to meet
the expenses of thaI. Commission. The
Hadley Report is with the Secretary of
State, he has not released it yet. Now
without producing reasonable arguments
is he going to agree to the expenditure
to meet the Commission of Enquiry when
he has a Report which he has not yet
released?
I have heard Members move motions
about the budget, of course, on which
everything in St. Vincent hinges. We
are here now asking for a Commission
of Enquiry. While in truth and in fact
all of us know that several steps have
been taken to implement certain things
to develop the educational standard
could not be implemented because the
financial position is not strong enough
to increase the expenditure on the edu-
cational standard. Now there are a few
points which most of us know many of
the points that affect our educational
system. It does not need a Commission
of Enquiry to tell you that. First of all
lack of accommodation. You have just
put on your development programme
75,000 to meet the accommodation of
the schools, etc. in which is included a
trade school.
The next point that is necessary as
far as I can see is the training of indi-
vidual teachers. I shall tell you why I
say that. We had one infant teacher
trained here and I thought that that
infant teacher would have been able to
train other teachers or to go round the
schools and to see that infant methods
were introduced in all the schools in the
island. Unfortunately we, the Legisla-
tors, agreed to the building of a prepara-
tory school and that trained teacher was
employed in the training of a certain
number of children of the Preparatory
School. Of course, although I am not
disagreeing with what I have assisted to
implement it is only training a small
number of our infants and it is too bad
because children turned out from the
Preparatory School are obtaining a bet-
ter standard or a better foundation to
carry on than the other schools of this
island, as against children coming from
the other primary schools. Which means
if we had better infant teachers through-
out all of our schools our standard of
education would have some improve-
ment. Next we want spleciaklid teatli-
ers. We must have specialised teachers.
Not having specialised teachers in the
different languages because we cannot
afford to have trained teachers in all of
our schools if we had specialised teach-
ers who could go around and supervise
the new methods, the new approaches,
the educational standard must improve.
Another point is our agricultural devel-
opment. The inclusion of agriculture on
the curriculum of our schools is neces-
sary. We know the facts but we are going
to waste time to set up a Commission of
Enquiry that would take a set of funds
that should go to prepare or train other
teachers that you want to raise the
standard of our children. The staff of
course is a matter of great importance
but is a Commission of Enquiry going to
help in the staffing of the schools? You
want a balanced staff in all the schools,
not a proper staff in a few schools and
an unbalanced staff in the other schools.
Those are the several points that were
brought up on the Commission which
sat to go into the educational system of
this island. If we are going to sit back
and wait for another Commission of En-
quiry to implement all these things we
are still going to be behind time. It is
our duty as Members of Finance Com-
mittee of the Legislative Council to find
the funds, the ways and means to change
this policy and to develop the education-
al standard of oui children. Not with
the Education Officer making a Report
and sending it here and we stay all day
ripping the Report to pieces and set up a
Commission of Enquiry on the Report.
Now I come to tl e last point which is
the most important point of the whole
affair whether you close your eyes to it
or not. You hear it all around you, you
will go on hearing it until such time as
a change occurs--eachers are dissatis-
fied with the rates and scales of pay. I
am going to start from the bottom.
The minimum wage of this country is
$1.20 per day. W ll that work out to
$36 per month for a daily worker. Well
do you expect to pa y a pupil teacher $22.
They must wear clean clothes; dress
properly and they are supposed to eat
well if they have to talk. all day. You
know children. You yourself get fed up
with your own children at home far less
children and not one, several, 25, 60, 70
and one little pupil teacher must attend
to them. Well now tell me how can a
teacher stand up all day and teach these
children? We all know that teachers
threatened to strike here some time last
year but only they didn't have the guts
to stand up on their hind legs and the
strike did not come off but perhaps if
they had done it there might have been
changes and we wouldn't be here now
asking for a Commission of Enquiry into
the educational system.
Year in year out you have sat in
Finance Committee and members say
teachers are under-paid but Finance
Committee is not even brave enough to
recommend any increase in the wages
and here we are, we, the same members
here, arguing about the educational sys-
tem. It is all of us, not Ministers or part
of Government. It rests on the should-
ers of every individual here, every elect-
ed Member. There is no point coming
in the Legislative Council -and blowing
hot air and getting back to Finance Com-
mittee and blowing cold air. No, that
cant' work. The people must know the
facts. Unless we pat our teachers we
are going to have the same thing over
and over again. You have 10 Education
Officers, 11 Inspectors of Schools and 20
Commissions of Enquiry unless you pay
your teachers you are going to have the
same thing unless we get down to the
fundamental points and give due satis-
faction to the entire teaching staff of
this country. And if we are going to
make an honest change to the education-
al system we must start right now.
Compulsory education was raised by
the Honourable Member for North Wind-
ward. We all agree that we should have
compulsory education but as another
Member told you there are children
under the belfry, under the tree and all
about no accommodation. Well of
course you are making efforts in the
development plan to take care of all of
that. But that is not all. To have com-
pulsory education you have to have what
you call a sort of police, not military
organisation but Inspectors who will go
around to see that these children go to
school. That needs money again to im-
plement that. And the last was raised
at Finance Committee and we, the same
men but in a different room, we just
change from the Legislature and go to
Finance to discuss those points, I remem-
ber after the motion was passed this
matter was discussed in Finance Commit-
tee. We left it alone for a little while
until our financial position should be a
little better off. Compulsory education
was left off by Finance Committee. We,
the members here decided we should not
implement it through lack of finance.
That is why we must not blow hot air
outside and then blow cold air inside.
HoirouRaAL E. T. JOSHUA: On a point
of order. The Minister is making sweep-
ing statements.
PsruIDNT: What is it?
HONOURABLE E. T. JOSHUA: I rise on a
point of order.
PRE SDET: There is no point of order
unless you explain it.
HONOURABLE E. T. JOSHUA: When he
says "all of you Members." We gener-
ally take sides in these things and then
there is a division, so therefore he'll have
to correct his statement.
PRESIDENT: That's not a point of
order.
HONOURABLE C. L. TENNIS: Of course
the day will arrive when we will all have
to face hard facts. Some of us must
-make sweeping statements outside and
are not prepared to stand by them on
the inside.
HONOURABLE E. T. JOSHUA: You can
stand up there and make any false state-
ment that you like.
HONOURABLE C. L. TENNIS: I welcome
the day when we would be able to imple-
ment compulsory education in this is-
land, and I say the quicker that day
arrives would be better for St. Vincent,
socially, economically and more so,
politically.
An amendment was moved by the
acting Minister for Education and Social
Services. If that amendment was ac-
cepted I would be prepared to vote
wholeheartedly on this motion as amend-
ed but I would not agree for one mo-
ment, judging the present position where
the release of the Hadley Report is
being awaited on to have another Com-
mission of Enquiry. I hope the Mover
of this motion would weigh the points
put forward by this House very carefully
this morning and if he is prepared to be
stubborn he would see the way to accept
the amendment moved by the Acting
Minister of Education and Social Ser-
vices.
HONOURABLE L. C. LATHAM: Mr. Presi-
dent, Honourable Members, to brief on
this summing up I have seen the
trend of this motion. I have seen how
the Honourable Ministers twisted it out
of proportion.
Now the second part of this motion
says:
"AND WHEREAS there is obvious dis-
satisfaction among the rank and file
of the Primary School Teachers, hence
the very unsatisfactory result in the
Schools as pointed out in the report
under review."
This motion spoke nothing about Mr.
Hadley's Report. Mr. Hadley's Report
cannot know that there is dissatisfac-
tion among the rank and file of the
teachers. We are not talking about the
Hadley Report. If 1 didn't bring this
motion here this morning we would not
have heard one thing about the Hadley
Report. They never read the second
paragraph in the motion. Just glimpsed
at it, Mr. President. It was so surpris-
ing to me to see the Ministers, the Min-
isters of Social Services, the Reverend of
Communications and Works, and the
Bishop of Trade and Production, learned
men, twist it out of proportion. I know
I could see the impression on the Presi-
dent's face. It is five and if the Presi-
dent has a casting vote he will throw his
weight on this motion here this morning.
Mr. President, I heard the Minister of
Trade and Production talk about no
money. We have here for a five year
development plan about 540,000 and the
schools come into this. But the chief
aim and object of this motion is the dis-
satisfaction of teachers, we are not
speaking about overcrowding. We know
the schools are overcrowded. We didn't
come to speak about Mr. Hadley's Re-
port but this motion is based on the dis-
satisfaction of the primary school teach-
ers hence this unsatisfactory Report.
Now if we look at the Gazette of the 20th
December, 1955, we will see we have a
few children who got entry into the
Secondary School by government schol-
arship.
We have over 45,000 or 50,000 children
who are of age to leave the primary
school and what we see? 7 children
pass out of 45,000.
HONOURABLE E. A. C. HUGHES: Mr.
President, On a point of information I
heard the Honourable Member for North
Windward say there were 32,000 now
they have increased. I know the popu-
lation increases rapidly here but have we
arrived at 45,000? I took the 32,000 to
mean from infants upwards. Now we
here there are 45,000 children of school
age a 50% increase in ten minutes.
HONOURABLE L. C. LATHAM: About,
about. Now we find here 7 children
have been able to pass the entrance ex-
amination and the 7 is self first. Those
people who have anything to do with it
-I would not sell myself out and leave
myself undone. Those children belong
to pupil teachers because why: They are
dissatisfied. The whole of our primary
education system are dissatisfied. That
is what the motion drives at. This mo--
tion didn't seek to implement Mr.
Hadley's Report. If even Mr. Hadley's
Report come up it would not help be-
cause the teachers are dissatisfied all
around. With pay and other conditions.
Some time ago Mr. President, Honour-
able Members, teachers were transferred
faster than policemen. A teacher from
Brighton was told to go to Georgetown
on Monday and she was told so on Thurs-
day and she had to report to the George-
town school on Monday and by Friday
she had to report to Chateaubelair.
Especially a girl. And what happened?
She told the father and the father said
you know what happen I can afford to
mind you, and the next few weeks her
family sent for her. She came up here
couple times she is married and settled
down. If she were to move to go and
she had no one to take care of when
she goes to Chateaubelair what would
happen to that girl? All those condi-
tions didn't boil down to Mr. Hadley's
Report. I am sure the Honourable Min-
ister for Trade and Production boil it up
in his report and I have heard the
Minister for Production state here that
we must be careful how we bring mo-
tions here. It is the second time I
heard him say those words since he went
over on the other side. He says we
must be careful how we bring motions
here.
HONOURABLE E. A. C. HUGHES: Don't
you agree?
HONOURABLE L. C. LATHAM: Yes, I
agree. We all have seen the trend of
the tWisting of this motion. This mo-
tion sought to make enquiry into the
rank and file of the primary school
teachers and I don't see how they can
say we have no money because we have
here under the five year development
plan over 75,000 for schools.
HONOURABLE H. F. YOUNG: That's to
build schools.
HONOURABLE L. C. LATHAM: Building
schools is one. But who will man the
schools if the staff is dissatisfied? How
will you get the staff if the teachers are
dissatisfied? 75% of our teachers make
$108 per month. They are not allowed
to do any business, they are not allowed
to work lands and the Minister Acting
for Social Serviceg he is an advocate for
schools. Since I came here on! this Coun-
cil in January 1945 he has been blazing
out here, you could hear his mouth all
down by the Cathedral, blazing out
about schools. This morning he is
twisting ....
HONOURABLE H. F. YOUNG: On a point
of order there is no twisting. All I did
was to amend your motion. I only
moved an amendment but I am in total
agreement with it.
HONOURABLE L. C. LATHAM: Alright
Mr. President, the Minister says he is in
total agreement with it so I can take my
seat.
HONOURABLE E. A. C. HUGHES: As
amended.
HONOURABLE L. C. LATHAM: No, not as
amended.
HONOURABIIE H. F. YOUNG: The issue
is what I agree with.
HONOURABLE H. F. YOUNG: The Chair-
man, Honourable Members, I have lis-
tened and especially the Honourable
Member for North Windward, my Friend,
to this little motion being treated so
irrelevantly. As usual having a chance
to speak twisting something that every
Member of this Government today
agreed on. As the Mover rightly said I
quote it around this table and I will say
it again, if you have to put them under
trees for God' sake educate our children.
Honourable R. E. Baynes moved a mo-
tion let us have compulsory education.
Therefore, I would not stand here be-
cause of constitutional changes, and be-
cause of the fact that we are Ministers
don't think that we don't love our people.
This is the time we can help them. This
is the time when we were there and did
not vote, have a chance now-respon-
sible Government that has taken place
all over the world. Don't nip it away
because of jealousy. You have listened
to every one of us here supporting you,
not supporting the motion in its true
form but asking for an amendment
below. You go up and you made a few
remarks here.
PRESIDENT: I shall, ask the Honourable
Member to address the Chair. I didn't
get up.
HONOURABLE: H. F. YOUNG: Sorry,
Sir. The Honourable Member for North
Windward got up and he said about op-
pose and said all kinds of things about
being glad if they are not educated, I
wonder if he can look me straight in the
face and say that.....
HONOURABLE E. T. JOSHUA: Yes, the
more ignorant they are....
HONOURABLE H. F. YOUNG: And let me
tell you this that it would be a wonder-
ful thing if we could educate them so
that they cannot be easily fooled. I
wonder if he is not judging the position
so that he cannot easily fool them. The
big point is who made the Report?
Where you got the idea that schools were
unsatisfactory? From an honest mind-
ed Education Officer who has made the
Report and incorporated that condition.
Fair enough. Look at the basic thing.
Having informed us of that condition it
is for us to do something. You also said
the majority of primary schools that is
not taken in the literal sense. In front
of me the same Report is placed, and
there are only 8 schools unsatisfactory,
therefore it is not majority unsatisfac-
tory. Turn to page 4 and you will see
that. And you must give credit even if
you have an Education Department,
while I agree that a new approach to
education should take place, while I
agree with you that our problem in edu-
cation is making the primary school boys
fit for livelihood, I agree with you that a
change of curriculum is needed for the
West Indian way so that when they
leave school they can fit into the agri-
cultural pursuits of our country. I agree
that if this motion was worked isn't it
right for him as Education Officer to say
to us that these schools are unsatisfac-
tory? Is it his fault? No matter what
you pay some teachers if the human ele-
ment is not there they will still not
teach, but I am prepared to pay them.
Under our present set up the little child-
ren who are put there to teach our child-
ren are not trained teachers, therefore
can children teach children? We want
trained teachers. You go into the other
countries, almost everyone is a trained
teacher. Get back, and you will find a
little girl teaching 6th standard by force
of circumstances. Those are some of the
ills we want to remedy, those are some
of the ills the Education Department Is
trying to tell you, and if you have these
uncertified teachers, children who just
leave 6th standard who want training
themselves have a class of 15, 20 child-
ren in front of them and sometimes
more, 40 even. Gentlemen, as a Mem-
ber of this Government, now let us see
from a regional approach how we can
start training teachers. If you notice
certain schools and certain men like all
of us and in the good old days of Trou-
maca when Webster Clarke was teacher
there, and you go there now you would
find the average man of my age and wo-
man of culture and very good, almost
throughout the breadth of St. Vincent
you find that particular village to the
leeward the most cultured and intelli-
gent. It- shows that the man in the
school had something to offer, and re-
gardless of What you do unless you don't
train people you can get no results. Pay
them less, but some no matter what you
pay if they haven't got the human feel-
ing like some doctors, some doctors would
work for nothing to save a life, others if
you don't give that shilling there will be
no prescription, no medicine. I heard
again that teachers don't plant, are we
living in Russia? I who live in the coun-
try, I know teacher who have lands and
teachers, I heard the Member for North
Windward say teachers don't plant, but
aren't teachers members of the Arrow-
root Board by virtue of his arrowroot,
representing the peasants. A teacher at
Marriaqua has lands at Acres, teacher
Mr. A. of his constituency, teacher Mr.
X., and I heard around this table that
teachers are not supposed to work lands.
HONOURABLE L. C. LATHAM: On a point
of order, Mr. President, the Honourable
Member should know better than that,
it is in his wife's name.
HONOURABLE E. A. C. HUGHES: No, No,
No.
HONOURABLE H. F. YOUNG: Again,
Gentlemen, the practical thing is what I
like, whether it is in his wife's name,
whether it is in Mr. X. name, I wish I
had something to put in my wife's name
and still manage it. I wish I had .the
pT~tviege t have certain things and have
it in my wife's name and still manage it.
And to get back to the point, I am in
agreement and we have got to realise
facts. It is a pity that some of you
since this constitutional change and
since we actually are facing-I am mak-
ing a bold statement now, being grant-
aided do not realise and learn what is
the procedure and how Government is
run. I am sorry to say that some of the
elected members of Council sitting here
do not study what they have to face, and
they bark, bark but they do not get
results because they are only criticising
without offering any constructive criti-
cism. We are grant-aided. Everything
we want has to go to the Secretary of
State. By all means I am saying, as the
Acting Minister; that this particular
Hadley Report is overdue, long overdue.
Government is at fault, and they should
implement it. How did Mr. Hadley re-
port? How did he go about it? You
heard the Honourable Minister for Trade
and Production, men like Archdeacon
Maxwell, educationists in St. Vincent,
educationists in Grenada, educationists
in Dominica, a one common Government
sat in every one of the Windward Islands
and advised him. He sat as Chairman
compiling the Report, sent it up to the
Secretary of State, which I would take
a pleasure to tell you in my view it's
right there and it would soon be re-
leased. All I am asking now, and don't
make the Honourable Member for North
Windward believe that any one of us on
this side is against the motion. What we
are trying to do, because I personally
believe that something should be done
for education, but what we are asking
you to do is to wait for this Report so
that instead of spending unnecessary
money for the Commission the Report
might reveal quite a lot of things.
'Might' I say, that you yourself would be
glad for. If the Report is not good then
throw it out and come back and ask for
a Commission. So don't make these
gallery people hear and make the Hon-
ourable Member for North Windward,
when I know you are sincere twist the
motion and make this Government feel
that we are against the policy. of educa-
tion. One particular thing that I am
against is a Commission of Enquiry, but
I would hang with you to see my people
educated. I thank you.
Amendment put to the vote. House
divided; Ayes 5; Noes, 5 as follows:-
Ayes:
Hon. H. F. Young
,, C. L. Tannis
R. E. Baynes
A. D. W. Johnson
E. A. C. Hughes
5
Noes:
Hon. J. A. Baynes
,, A. C. Cyrus
,, E. T. Joshua
,, S. E. Slater
,, L. C. Latham
PRESIDENT: As there is a tie I have
considered very seriously the suggestion
that was made by the Honourable Mem-
ber for Central Windward, the Mover of
the substantive motion, but I regret that
I feel that I must support my colleagues
and I shall vote for the amendment.
Amended motion put to vote. House
divided; Ayes 5; Abstentions 5, as
follows:-
Ayes:
Hon. J. A. Baynes
,, A. C. Cyrus
,, E. T. Joshua
S. E. Slater
,, L. C. Latham
Abstentions:
Hon. H. F. Young
,, C. L. Tannis
,, R. E. Baynes
,, A. D. W. Johnson
,, E. A. C. Hughes
5
12.32 p.m. Sitting suspended.
2.35 p.m. Sitting resumed.
BILLS, FIRST READING
The following Bills were read a First
time:-
The Police (Amendment) Bill.
The Currency (Amendment) Bill.
Certificate of Urgency in respect of the
Police (Amendment) Bill was laid on the
Council Table.
BILLS, SECOND READING
The Police (Amendment) Bill.
HON. AG. FINANCIAL SECRETARY: I beg
to move the second reading of a Bill for
an Ordinance to amend the Police Ordi-
nance, 1947.
HON. R. E. BAYNES: Mr. President,
motion.
Question put and agreed.
Bill read a second time.
HON. E. T. JOSHUA: Mr. President,
Honourable Members, this is the appro-
priate time to make a statement. I
would not prolong a debate on this Bill
because it is just a scrap of a Bill but the
danger is twofold:
(1) The Certificate of Urgency being
attached, and
(2) the Crown Attorney is not here
to link this up with the relevant
section of the Principal Ordi-
nance.
Bills of the kind are being brought here
to be amended and what makes it worse
is when Certificates of Urgency are at-
tached. It can only mean that we
should know definitely by some Officer of
the Crown and take into account the
relationship of the amendment to the
Principal Ordinance.
HON. R. E. BAYNES: Mr. President,
Honourable Members, as far as I have
gathered from this amendment, the St
Vincent Government is employing a
Deputy Superintendent of Police and in
the Principal Ordinance there is no pro-
vision made for a Deputy Superinten-
dent of Police to perform duties in the
Office in St. Vincent and so the Police
Ordinance must be amended in order to
regularise the appointment of a Deputy
Superintendent of Police. I think that
is the object of the Bill.
Council moved into Committee.
Council resumed.
Bill reported without amendment and
report adopted.
Bill read a third time by title and
passed.
The Currency (Amendment) Bill.
Certificate of Urgency in respect of the
Currency (Amendment) Bill was laid on
the Council Table.
HON. AG. FINANCIAL SECRETARY: Mr.
President, Honourable Members, I beg
to move the second reading of a Bill for
an Ordinance to mend the Currency
Ordinance, 1950.
HON. R. E. BAYNES: I beg to second
the motion.
Question put and agreed.
Bill read a second time.
Council moved into Committee.
Council resumed.
Bill reported without amendment and
report adopted.
Bill read a third time by title and
passed.
PRESIDENT: As I announced at an
earlier stage, we are not at this meeting
proceeding with the Firearms Bill for
the reason of the absence of the Crown
Attorney as it is of a considerable tech-
nical nature. And the Agricultural Small
Tenancies Bill has not been reported
upon by the Select Committee. I shall
therefore be prepared to receive a
motion for the adjournment.
Sitting adjourned.
Publications Not Available
Saint Vincent government
gazette
v. 89 no. 53
Bill: Bill for an ordinance further to
amend the medical registration
ordinance.
Bill: Bill for an ordinance to create
the office of financial secretary...
Bill: Bill for an ordinance to amend
the rent restriction ordinance, 1945.
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